Megaten Haven 2.0 - Arguing over the Innocent sin patch

Louis Cypher Senior Member Posts: 299 Gender:	Arguing over the Innocent sin patch 03/03/08 at 20:35:00 ...Please tell me they're not gonna do this retardedly and make the names diferently. I mean, if you're going to do it for English speakers, why use the Japanese terms? It makes no sense. Bufudhain... Shivers
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Brand

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #1 - 03/03/08 at 20:53:47

Quote from Tallgeese on 03/03/08 at 20:35:00:

...Please tell me they're not gonna do this retardedly and make the names diferently. I mean, if you're going to do it for English speakers, why use the Japanese terms? It makes no sense.

Bufudhain... *Shivers*

I was pretty much thinking the same thing.

Here is a quote from the FAQ:
Quote:

Are you going to keep the translation consistent with Eternal Punishment?
Yes and no. Menus are probably going to say the same things EP says, but with some improvements. As for common terms, like Spell names and such, we are going to use the JP official names (which can be found on tarots), so except to see stuff like Agirao instead of Agilao or Meghidoraon instead of Megidolaon.

Uh, what? Is pretty much what came to mind for me. They have used Agilao and such for several games now, why change them? Agirao isn't really any more correct then Agilao when translating. I'd rather have consistency. Plus, the Japanese get English Spelling for things wrong or have different spellings on products all the time. I've seen a the same character's name spelled three different ways on official products before.

But it's his work and if that is the way he wants to do it then fine. I'd rather have an English patch to play then none.

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Louis Cypher Senior Member Posts: 299 Gender:	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #2 - 03/03/08 at 21:28:52 ...Oh come on, Meghido is RETARDED. EVERYONE knows by now that it is supposed to be MEGIDO, since Megido IS AN ACTUAL WORD pr at least is obviously based on Megiddo. Meghido means squat.
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ryu

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #3 - 03/04/08 at 03:00:45

Quote from Tallgeese on 03/03/08 at 21:28:52:

...Oh come on, Meghido is RETARDED.

EVERYONE knows by now that it is supposed to be MEGIDO, since Megido IS AN ACTUAL WORD pr at least is obviously based on Megiddo. Meghido means squat.

Tarots do not agree with you:

These are the official Japanese names. Only because Atlus US uses a slightly different nomenclature, it doesn't mean it has to be the correct one. Also, most names are not supposed to be actual words, like Berzack.

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Louis Cypher

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #4 - 03/04/08 at 16:32:02

...Do you think I actually care about the tarots?

I care about what makes rational sense. This move doesn't. Period.

It doesn't help that in practically every single translation EXCEPT THAT ONE it has been MEGIDO. Come on, we are talking the Japanese trying to translate something into Hebrew or English. Their track record has 'NEVER' been consistent, as Brand has noted.

Further, it IS correct insofar as English shores are concerned. It makes zero sense not to translate with consistency to Eternal Punishment or at least the Atlus US name convention, simply because if you don't, WHY BOTHER TRANSLATING IT FOR THE ENGLISH AUDIENCE!? If you want the Japanese nomes, play the Japanese version. At least Gideon Zhi was nice about this in his MegaMan and Bass translation for the SNES and included two seperate patches.

Oi, how I have to explain the most simple things.

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ryu

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #5 - 03/04/08 at 21:41:50

Quote from Tallgeese on 03/04/08 at 16:32:02:

...Do you think I actually care about the tarots?

Do you think they will care about people whining for some US official names? Those are the real names and Atlus JP confirmed them with EP. If you don't stand them, just don't play the goddamn thing. It's not difficult. This was never supposed to an Atlus US-like translation, you know.

Quote:

I care about what makes rational sense. This move doesn't. Period.

Because Agilao with an L makes more sense, huh?

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Isao Kronos Junior Member Remodeled Teacher Posts: 91 Gender:	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #6 - 03/04/08 at 22:20:44 ryu who the fuck are you and why are you such a fag
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ryu Less Newbies I Love Jack Frost! Posts: 7	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #7 - 03/04/08 at 23:14:47 Quote from Isao Kronos on 03/04/08 at 22:20:44: ryu who the fuck are you and why are you such a fag Man, chill out. I'm somebody informed on what is going on.
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Brand

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #8 - 03/05/08 at 00:47:51

If you start to argue I will beat you all with sticks!!!!! Ten sticks no less!!!!

I know the internet is serious businesses and all but please people chill. Ok so yes, I agree with Tallgeese I think it would be better to keep with the American naming convention. To me that makes more sense. But since this is not out work and someone else's (who is doing it for free) then I say they should do as they feel. I think we made out point and they made theirs and we just feel different about it. If you don't like you don't have to play it. Let us not get into a heated debate about it.

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ryu Less Newbies I Love Jack Frost! Posts: 7	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #9 - 03/05/08 at 01:10:20 Quote from Brand on 03/05/08 at 00:47:51: If you don't like you don't have to play it. Let us not get into a heated debate about it. Well said! I love how diplomatic some admins can be.
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Isao Kronos Junior Member Remodeled Teacher Posts: 91 Gender:	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #10 - 03/05/08 at 01:35:32 Ass-kisser.
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ryu Less Newbies I Love Jack Frost! Posts: 7	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #11 - 03/05/08 at 02:37:35 Quote from Isao Kronos on 03/05/08 at 01:35:32: Ass-kisser. I don't need to kiss anybody's ass, but you should learn how to behave. Seriously, -you- look like an ass with those flaming posts.
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Isao Kronos Junior Member Remodeled Teacher Posts: 91 Gender:	Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch? Reply #12 - 03/05/08 at 02:54:43 I've been here since Kuzunoha, and nobody's gotten as whiny about my posts as you have. Except maybe mikey or terrorbread. Jesus fuck, I'm not Heat.
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Louis Cypher

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #13 - 03/05/08 at 03:13:09

Quote from Brand on 03/05/08 at 00:47:51:

If you start to argue I will beat you all with sticks!!!!! Ten sticks no less!!!!

I know the internet is serious businesses and all but please people chill. Ok so yes, I agree with Tallgeese I think it would be better to keep with the American naming convention. To me that makes more sense. But since this is not out work and someone else's (who is doing it for free) then I say they should do as they feel.

Hopefully the tools at least will be released so somebody can inject some rationality into this.

---

What's hilarious is I never even said much of anything about Agilao. Joys of strawman.

Also... heh, real names... tsk tsk, relying on an English transliteration from Japan. Where if I look at the SMT II Demoniac, Raphael is 'Ruphael', and Sabaoth is 'Zabaot' (this after ironically getting it almost right in SMT1's intro... Sebaoth I think). WHOOPS BETTER PUT HIM AS THAT NOW. LET"S GO PEOPLE! GOTTA GET IT LIKE THE JAPANESE SAY IT SHOULD BE IN ENGLISH! Come on. Your argument is totally fallacious and above that makes no sense to anybody who thinks about it. This translation already looks hopeless in the vein of RPGOne's dry-as-sin FF6 patch.

These names are not even consistent with how the spells have been translated by fans for years in at least two areas across multiple games, that'll be a loop...

Your rationales are simply no good to any impartial entity considering Japan's transliteration track record.

Now I'm not saying Atlus US is perfect (Feng Huang anyone?), but at lesat after EP they've been consistent with one exception I can think of off the top of my head (they tightened up Prayer into the more contextually accurate Salvation).

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ryu

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Re: Whats the status of the Innocent sin patch?
Reply #14 - 03/05/08 at 03:51:08

Quote from Tallgeese on 03/05/08 at 03:13:09:

Hopefully the tools at least will be released so somebody can inject some rationality into this.

I can confirm you that won't happen. Maybe a double patch with both US and JP names, but I've never seen Gemini releasing any of his tools.

Quote:

What's hilarious is I never even said much of anything about Agilao.

In fact that was only an example of what changes they introduced.

Quote:

Also... heh, real names... tsk tsk, relying on an English transliteration from Japan. Where if I look at the SMT II Demoniac, Raphael is 'Ruphael', and Sabaoth is 'Zabaot' (this after ironically getting it almost right in SMT1's intro... Sebaoth I think). WHOOPS BETTER PUT HIM AS THAT NOW. LET"S GO PEOPLE! GOTTA GET IT LIKE THE JAPANESE SAY IT SHOULD BE IN ENGLISH! Come on.

Still the old stereotype of Japanese people with no knowledge of foreign languages, especially English. You know, some of them can speak English better than you could ever imagine. They made only a couple of English typos in IS (both in the staff roll: Metal Dady and Ishkick), so that makes me think they knew what they were writing in those Romaji snippets.

Quote:

Your argument is totally fallacious and above that makes no sense to anybody who thinks about it. This translation already looks hopeless in the vein of RPGOne's dry-as-sin FF6 patch.

Wow, what a superficial analysis of the translation. Funny how everybody else who doesn't give a shit about Atlus US glossary says exactly the opposite and considers the translation style far superior than EP's.

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